Atir Khan

Pakistan faces formidable challenges in its quest for scientific progress, with societal stagnation and a lack of intellectual curiosity often stifling innovation and development. Dr. Pervez Amirali Hoodbhoy, a distinguished Pakistani nuclear physicist, educator, and passionate advocate for science and rational thinking, reflects on the barriers to scientific advancement in his country in an interview with Awaz-The Voice Editor-in-Chief Atir Khan.

Dr. Hoodbhoy also explores the global landscape of innovation and underscores the crucial role of reason in shaping the future of both nations and individuals. He highlights the historical disengagement with science in Muslim societies and stresses the urgent need to embrace scientific thinking and reason to overcome these challenges. 

His perspective offers a compelling vision for the future of science and innovation, particularly in Pakistan and the wider Muslim world. Excerpts:

You have often spoken about the relationship between science and religion. Can you elaborate on your perspective?

Absolutely! I believe that the universality of physical laws shows that science and religion are fundamentally separate. For example, science is based on evidence and observation; whereas, religion often involves belief without evidence. The laws of physics apply universally, whether you are in Pakistan, the United States, or anywhere else. This makes it clear that religion and science operate in different spheres.

But don't you think that people, including some scientists, sometimes mix religion with science, even in countries with rich scientific traditions?

Yes, that’s true. I grew up in a world where science was often challenged by religious ideologies. I was told by many, including some prominent people, that we should not engage in scientific progress because it conflicts with faith. This was frustrating, especially when I saw countries that had advanced scientifically and technologically due to their reliance on reason and evidence-based thinking.

You have mentioned that some countries, like Pakistan, are struggling with scientific development. What do you think is the root cause of this?

The issue lies in the lack of intellectual curiosity and a widespread rejection of scientific methods. We often look back to the past instead of focusing on the future. For instance, during the Mughal era in India, many scientific advancements were ignored or dismissed. It was not until the Enlightenment in the West that the pursuit of knowledge through reason gained prominence. 

In many parts of the world, including Pakistan, the pursuit of scientific knowledge is still hindered by cultural and religious constraints.

So, do you think the mindset needs to change for Pakistan to progress scientifically?

Absolutely. Pakistan needs to embrace a scientific temper. We need to value curiosity, critical thinking, and open inquiry. The key to scientific progress is not just learning from textbooks but fostering a culture where questioning and exploration are encouraged. Unfortunately, this is not yet the case in many parts of Pakistan, where the focus is often on tradition rather than innovation.

You have also mentioned that there is a lack of role models in Pakistan for the younger generation. Can you explain?

Yes, role models are essential. In Pakistan, many bright minds who could inspire the next generation of scientists are either ignored or sidelined. Take the example of Dr. Abdus Salam, the Nobel laureate from Pakistan. His contributions to physics were groundbreaking, yet he became a victim of sectarianism. This is a tragedy for Pakistan, as we could have used his example to inspire young minds, but instead, his achievements were often overlooked due to narrow-minded thinking.

So, you feel that the country’s scientific community is not being properly recognised?

Exactly. Instead of celebrating scientific achievements, we often prioritise politics or religious identity. This is a major hindrance to the intellectual growth of the nation. If we want to compete on the global stage, we must value and invest in science. This requires a shift in how we educate our youth, how we foster innovation and how we recognise and promote scientific achievements.

Moving on to a broader issue — many countries, particularly in the Muslim world, have not made the same progress in science as others. Why do you think that is?

That is a complex question. While the Muslim world historically contributed significantly to science during the golden age of Islam, there has been a decline in intellectual curiosity and scientific innovation. This decline coincided with a rise in religious orthodoxy, which led to a closure of the mind. The scientific community in the Muslim world has often been stifled by a reluctance to embrace reason and evidence-based thinking, which are the cornerstones of scientific inquiry.

So, do you think there is still hope for a resurgence of scientific curiosity in these regions?

Yes, but it will take time. The first step is introspection — an honest examination of why we lag in science. It is not just about adopting modern technology, it is about adopting a scientific mindset. Countries like Pakistan must start valuing curiosity, experimentation, and critical thinking. Only then can we hope to catch up with the rest of the world in terms of scientific progress?

Do you see any positive changes happening in Pakistan in terms of science and technology?

There are small signs of progress. A growing number of young people are showing interest in science and technology, and there are a few institutions making strides. However, the pace of change is slow, and much more needs to be done. We need more investments in education, research and infrastructure. Most importantly, we need to create an environment where science is respected, and where intellectual freedom is encouraged.

You mentioned the importance of role models earlier. Do you think Pakistan has any modern-day scientific heroes?

It is difficult to say. While there are many talented individuals, the lack of recognition and support for science in Pakistan means that we do not often hear about them. There are some notable people in academia and research, but they often do not get the kind of recognition they deserve. A true scientific hero is someone who not only excels in their field but also inspires others to pursue knowledge and contribute to the advancement of society.

Dr. Hoodbhoy, you have been very outspoken about the intersection of science, religion and politics. Do you feel that your views have made you a target?

Yes, unfortunately. Speaking out against the politicisation of science, particularly in a country like Pakistan, can be controversial. But I believe it is important to challenge the status quo. If we don’t speak out, we will continue to suffer the consequences of a society that values ideology over reason.

Transcribed by Tarique Anwar

Full Interview: